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Hobbit
02-06-2012, 02:36 AM
well this one has me stumped good and proper, as many know i recently installed home made grilles to the bike and i know these have nothing to do with non starting, its been doing it for a few weeks LOL

symptoms
clicking from starter like a bad relay or starter, or flat battery nothing more nothing less just a click :(

well after putting it all back together i went to start it and CLICK - arghhhhhhh, so off comes the air box cover so i can check the voltage on the battery as i can clearly here the relay/solenoid clicking, all the guages work and the light is bright and doesnt flicker when starter pressed suggesting battery is fine.
so i check battery 12.5V when everything is off - so the battery is good to go
check the connections all nice and tight and greased

so i leave the cover off and try to start it CLICK - arse

check diagnostics - no codes ???
fuel pump spins up and everything seemed to work (yeah i know falt bats do this)
so i move the bars and pull in the clutch and thumb the starter - BOOM fires up but sounds as rough as a bears arse, lumpy running and wont throttle up, left it a while and it smoothed out and started to rev up nicely - bizzare.

So its either defective wiring - switch housing, bars or a defective clutch switch will see as i still cant get it out the garage and up the slope to ride it to the dealer or work starts fine with bars dead ahead

i wont be impressed if the relay has failed/switch has failed, wiring is broke on a 6month old bike with 3500miles on it :(

Jaystronghawk
02-06-2012, 07:32 AM
Hope get this sorted out soon .. Just a shot here, but is there any related wiring near the area the radiator guard was hit?

Hobbit
02-06-2012, 08:26 AM
Hope get this sorted out soon .. Just a shot here, but is there any related wiring near the area the radiator guard was hit?
yes its all behind the shroud and protected and there was no damage to the wiring

smokenjoep01
02-06-2012, 08:58 AM
Sorry to hear about your bad luck. What did you change?

flame883
02-06-2012, 09:18 AM
Ummmmm, warranty?

Hobbit
02-06-2012, 09:21 AM
Joe ive replaced nothing yet and its been running fine its only recently started to do this, when my ultra did this it was loose connections on the battery but the connections are tight on all the earth points as well, ive gone over the elecs i can see without ripping into the area behind the head light - thats next or if it starts its gonig the dealer and they can find the issue as i know of one Vrod recently having a complete new loom !!!!!!

Hobbit
02-06-2012, 09:21 AM
Ummmmm, warranty?

yup :D

ultrat
02-06-2012, 10:04 AM
:Sounds like you have a eye on it ',.'Just sending you good luck. -',:-)

smokenjoep01
02-07-2012, 10:00 AM
I see very few electrical issues with late model Harleys wiring, connectors, componets. Get it to the dealer for warranty repair. Keep us posted what it is.

Hobbit
02-07-2012, 10:39 AM
I see very few electrical issues with late model Harleys wiring, connectors, componets. Get it to the dealer for warranty repair. Keep us posted what it is.
on the way home it started and stalled and then seemed to misfire, it settled down after while but it all seems to point at something breaking down - i hate electrics

ultrat
02-07-2012, 10:51 AM
Dang .....

Tbones
02-07-2012, 02:18 PM
well this one has me stumped good and proper, as many know i recently installed home made grilles to the bike and i know these have nothing to do with non starting, its been doing it for a few weeks LOL

symptoms
clicking from starter like a bad relay or starter, or flat battery nothing more nothing less just a click :(

well after putting it all back together i went to start it and CLICK - arghhhhhhh, so off comes the air box cover so i can check the voltage on the battery as i can clearly here the relay/solenoid clicking, all the guages work and the light is bright and doesnt flicker when starter pressed suggesting battery is fine.
so i check battery 12.5V when everything is off - so the battery is good to go
check the connections all nice and tight and greased

so i leave the cover off and try to start it CLICK - arse

check diagnostics - no codes ???
fuel pump spins up and everything seemed to work (yeah i know falt bats do this)
so i move the bars and pull in the clutch and thumb the starter - BOOM fires up but sounds as rough as a bears arse, lumpy running and wont throttle up, left it a while and it smoothed out and started to rev up nicely - bizzare.

So its either defective wiring - switch housing, bars or a defective clutch switch will see as i still cant get it out the garage and up the slope to ride it to the dealer or work starts fine with bars dead ahead

i wont be impressed if the relay has failed/switch has failed, wiring is broke on a 6month old bike with 3500miles on it :(

Rob, did you remove the lower portion of the air box and check the ground cable to the front cylinder? If that nut is loose, you will have this sort of intermittent problem... You have to take the entire air box off in order to see and get to that ground cable...

Hobbit
02-10-2012, 10:50 AM
Well after it didn't start last night whilst snowing I took it the dealer this morning, also had a proper look at the 2 new models - after seeing them nothing reall shouted buy me, well they found the problem - severe corrosion on the starter solenoid between the 2 connectors so much so the current wasn't running into the solenoid but straight between the 2 connectors giving the impression of dead battery, parts orderd for warranty - cable from bat to solenoid , solenoid to starter , new terminals , and solenoid- this after 6 months !!!! Even the shop was shocked specially as they were covered in grease !!!!

Tbones
02-10-2012, 11:10 AM
Kewl, glad they figured out the problem... That is unusual especially with grease which is suppose to prevent corrosion build-up...

Hobbit
02-10-2012, 11:25 AM
Kewl, glad they figured out the problem... That is unusual especially with grease which is suppose to prevent corrosion build-up...
thats exactly what the tech said but most of the connectors were showing signs of corrosion and he said he knew it had been done as he did it - HD says spray all connectors with battery connection spray - so i dont think its much good TBH - its not proper dielectirc grease - which has also been ordered and they are going to pack all the connectors when they do the warranty work

Hobbit
02-10-2012, 11:27 AM
shame i dont have the pick - what looked like mud between the 2 solenoid posts was RUST !!!!!

Tbones
02-10-2012, 11:34 AM
thats exactly what the tech said but most of the connectors were showing signs of corrosion and he said he knew it had been done as he did it - HD says spray all connectors with battery connection spray - so i dont think its much good TBH - its not proper dielectirc grease - which has also been ordered and they are going to pack all the connectors when they do the warranty work
Yeah, the stuff they used from the MoCo is probably good for over here and not good for islands with damp, cool, salt air... They get the dielectric grease in, that should do the trick... This is the first time I've heard of this problem on the Rod's so it will go in my diddy bag for any future similar problems :)... I had a very similar problem with mine and it was the negative cable to the front head... The lock nut on the head stud was just loose enuff that it would cause intermittent electrical issues similar to what you were experiencing... What it actually was with your bike is good to know and remember :)...

Hobbit
02-10-2012, 11:38 AM
i can tell you it makes a change to find an issue and get it resolved simply and quickly - ok its not fully done yet as the parts arent in but it was nice to see again quick service from the dealer - one that believe it or not gets a lot of stick from other owners for being rubbish - mind if you are going to leave you nice ultra under a cover for 18months in the rain and cold and so on without caring for it how is it the dealers fault when you come to use it to see it covered im moss/rust and mildew and wonder why it wont start !!!

smokenjoep01
02-10-2012, 11:50 AM
Were doyou live? It prety humid here in the southeastern US and Ive never seen corrosion. Only from bikes stored outside beach front homes.
That brings me to thinking. If you can afford a bike and ocean front property why cant they afford covered storage for said bikes??
Glad you got it straight. Ride safe

Tbones
02-10-2012, 11:52 AM
Yup, some folks never want to take responsibility for being the problem when it is much easier to blame the dealer or mechanic... There are plenty of examples both ways... Moisture mixed with salt air is a nightmare, it gets into everything...

Tbones
02-10-2012, 11:56 AM
Were doyou live? It prety humid here in the southeastern US and Ive never seen corrosion. Only from bikes stored outside beach front homes.
That brings me to thinking. If you can afford a bike and ocean front property why cant they afford covered storage for said bikes??
Glad you got it straight. Ride safe
He lives in England Joe so he gets not only humidity but salt air mixed in... In the south, you deal with humidity but you don't have the salt air unless you live along the coastline... Humidity + salt corrodes everything that is metal... I've had bikes come in my shop over the years that the owners moved here from the coast or Hawaii and all of the chrome was chipped and peeled, rust on all of the bolts, corrosion on just about every electrical connection... Where I live, I'm in the desert with very lil humidity... The only problem I have to deal with is the sand and dust :)...

Hobbit
02-10-2012, 12:07 PM
Were doyou live? It prety humid here in the southeastern US and Ive never seen corrosion. Only from bikes stored outside beach front homes.
That brings me to thinking. If you can afford a bike and ocean front property why cant they afford covered storage for said bikes??
Glad you got it straight. Ride safeJoe as T said i live in the UK thankfully i dont live near the coast but we have a tendancy to coat the roads with rock salt or urea and or sea water during the winter to stop the roads freezing and despite me spray in the bike with ACF45 anti corrosion it still happened :( guess this year the roads have been heavily coated as my bike before i hosed it down today was crystal white in places from the salt drying out - its now been rinsed washed with WAX and rinsed and dried again and is now going away into its nice warm garage whilst i do night shifts :D - i hate SALT

Tbones
02-10-2012, 03:12 PM
Well that would explain it, never heard of using salt water on roads before :)... You Brit's come up with some good chit :)... I think they quit using salt on roadways here in the states because of EPA standards :)... Yup, salt is considered hazardous material and could get into the river and ground water killing off millions of fish :)... Even though you don't live directly on the coast, because you are on an island, your air has salt in it even inland just not as bad as if you were right there on the coast... Plus, how much rain fall do you get annually? I'd bet it is a lot like the Pacific Northwest like where Clint lives... I think they get about 2 months sunshine per year if that :)... And, you get a lot of fog too right? What you need to do brother is live over here :)... Then all you gotta worry bout is dust and sand where I live :)...

RumRunner
02-10-2012, 03:26 PM
We still use salt on the roads here. Have it shipped in on barges and they have a HUGE salt pile in East Boston on the banks of a small river just inside Boston harbor. A lot of the time it's sand/salt mix, but sometimes just straight salt for only ice conditions. Of course they use a few other things for pre-treating roads these days too.

A couple pics of the salt pile in East Boston, covered with a tarp :D

1013910138

ultrat
02-10-2012, 03:41 PM
Used in our area 2.. shipped into burns harbor port.. then used in St Joe river valley & the great lake states .. a mix of sand & sale..

smokenjoep01
02-10-2012, 03:58 PM
T- FYI, I live three miles from the beach in North Carlolina. Plenty of salt in the air and have yet to see it. As I know from living in Central Mass what corrosion looks like.
The type corrosion he has going on for sure would be road salt. Dam you guys really need to get your riding in when you can. Dont that freezing air knumb your forehead when you ride?
Here at the beach we use salt for our margritas! IF we do get cold enough for icy roads. They go down to the beach with a dump truck fill it up with beach sand and have a couple guys in the the back with shovels spreading it out while cruising down the street.

Big T
02-10-2012, 04:03 PM
They use a lot of salt on the roads in Minnesota, in the winter even when the roads are dry, your clean car will soon be white with a coating of salt. That is the reason I put the bike away from the time they put the first application of salt on the roads and i won't bring it back out until the roads are clean in the spring. Hard to do when we have had so many nice days this winter. I just read that our winter from December 1st to February 7th was the second warmest on record with an average of 27 deg, that is 9 deg warmer than normal. The county that I live in just closed access to all lakes preventing cars from driving on the lakes for fishing because the ice is not safe in too many places and vehicles are falling through.

RumRunner
02-10-2012, 04:04 PM
IF we do get cold enough for icy roads. They go down to the beach with a dump truck fill it up with beach sand and have a couple guys in the the back with shovels spreading it out while cruising down the street.

Sounds like my kind of place.. may need to consider a relocation at some point :D

Tbones
02-10-2012, 05:56 PM
T- FYI, I live three miles from the beach in North Carlolina. Plenty of salt in the air and have yet to see it. As I know from living in Central Mass what corrosion looks like.
The type corrosion he has going on for sure would be road salt. Dam you guys really need to get your riding in when you can. Dont that freezing air knumb your forehead when you ride?
Here at the beach we use salt for our margritas! IF we do get cold enough for icy roads. They go down to the beach with a dump truck fill it up with beach sand and have a couple guys in the the back with shovels spreading it out while cruising down the street.

You need to re-read what I said, I said the salt water on the road explains it... Living on an island produces much more salt in the air than living on the coast and it also has to do with humidity levels and prevailing winds as to how much salt content is in the air... Obviously, I was wrong about using salt on the roads in the states, apparently where I live is a no no... Can't even dump table salt in the sink out at work because it is considered a hazardous material... Might be that is the only place that doesn't use salt is out on the Nuclear reservation...

Bagger
02-10-2012, 06:59 PM
Can't help but wonder if the bike got stuck in a shipping container for an extended period of time.Customs can be a bitch and those containers will age a bike faster than any weather conditions.

Hobbit
02-11-2012, 12:55 AM
Can't help but wonder if the bike got stuck in a shipping container for an extended period of time.Customs can be a bitch and those containers will age a bike faster than any weather conditions.

possibly but they said it was fine on the PDI - the rust and electrical fretting was not good and no other part is rusty or corroded just the elecs - they live right behind the headstock in the firing line of forced rain or water

flame883
02-11-2012, 06:47 AM
Glad you're getting it fixed, Hobbit. I've read posts from a bunch of your island brothers complaining of rust on almost brand new Harleys, even on powder coated items somehow.

posted by angry birds using tapatalk

Hobbit
02-11-2012, 08:53 AM
Glad you're getting it fixed, Hobbit. I've read posts from a bunch of your island brothers complaining of rust on almost brand new Harleys, even on powder coated items somehow.

posted by angry birds using tapatalk

I had the frame on a brand new dyna replaced due to the powder coming off round a weld and going rusty

Bob Loblaw
02-11-2012, 10:13 AM
Can't help but wonder if the bike got stuck in a shipping container for an extended period of time.Customs can be a bitch and those containers will age a bike faster than any weather conditions.

Great line of reasoning....

Hobbit
03-24-2012, 06:08 AM
well i rang the dealer to find out about my parts for this issue to be told the parts are no obsolete !!!!!!! WTF the bike is 6months old how the feck can they be obsolete !!!!!!!!

the only way i can see these parts are obsolete is if HD have realised its an issue and have improved the parts - pissed is not the word if it strands me cos it wont start im going to go BAT SHIT

Tbones
03-24-2012, 11:14 AM
well i rang the dealer to find out about my parts for this issue to be told the parts are no obsolete !!!!!!! WTF the bike is 6months old how the feck can they be obsolete !!!!!!!!

the only way i can see these parts are obsolete is if HD have realised its an issue and have improved the parts - pissed is not the word if it strands me cos it wont start im going to go BAT SHIT
What's the part number? I can find out real quick for you if the part is still available... Your right, that does not make sense for "new" motorcycles and would be a first for HD to discontinue making a part or like you said, if the part is obsolete than it has to have been updated usually with a letter or year number...